2011 Greensfelder Challenge: A Fundraiser Benefiting GORC

Saturday, May 7, 2011

A steady stream of 152 racers arrived at Greensfelder County Park to participate in one of the area's hardest mountain bike races. This particular race was special to GORC as the promoters of the race series, the United Federation of Dirt (UFD), turned it into a fundraiser for the club. Known as the Greensfelder Challenge, the annual race was first held in 2010.

Readying for 3 hours of Marathon bliss

This year's course was a half-mile shorter but offered over an additional mile and a half of singletrack. Members of GORC had designed a half-mile reroute that addressed a severely eroded and abused portion of the Deer Run trail. This new sustainable multi-use reroute snaked down a steep, scenic hillside from the Scenic Loop Road and connected to the super fast, technical Deer Run drop-in that catapulted racers onto the Eagle Valley gravel path. Turning left in 2011 showcased GORC's hard work from 2009-2011 to build a sustainable singletrack climb up to the Visitor's Center. This climb needed substantial armoring and drainage due to several seeps that "magically" appeared after the initial build. This long climb switchbacked three times above itself allowing for spectators to see racers climbing on three singletrack "levels."

However, the race almost didn't happen as a short but steady rain moved through the area in the wee hours of the morning. With the Marathon and Beginner Cat 3 classes launching at 10:00 the GORC honchos grilled pre-riders attempting to ascertain the course conditions. After several bouts of what-ifs it was agreed the trails would hold up quite well.

Jeff focusing on his perfection that is known as 'pulled pork sammich'

And they did! Despite the wetness during the first two laps of Marathon, the course firmed up over the course of the day as the sun came out to support GORC. Jeff Rippelmeyer, Bob and Steph manned the BBQ and brew booth all day long. Jeff's legendary grilling skills were confirmed the entire day as racers and spectators chowed down on excellent pulled pork sandwiches. The two Schlafly kegs, a hefe and pale ale, died honorably and swiftly. The thirsty crowds demanded more and so the gas stations in Eureka were raided with all available cans hauled back up the hill to the BBQ tent.

A healthy dose of GORCers represented in the race and did quite well. Scott Peipert (Cat I Expert), Jason Zoll (Marathon), Matt Hayes (single speed), Christine Ford (Cat I Women), Loreen Matson (Cat I Women), among others, all took home medals in their respective categories.

GORC members readying to single speed for two laps

The donations to GORC poured in ALL DAY LONG from racers and supporters. We raised more than enough to cover our mandatory but 'painful' insurance expense. This insurance allows us to host workdays at all the parks where we build and maintain trails. And to our surprise, Mesa Cycles donated a massive $1,000.00 to GORC. All we can say is thank you and will continue to build stellar trail for all to enjoy.

GORC crew enjoying the carbonated goodies from Schlafly.
Thanks to all those who volunteered!

The 2011 Greensfelder Challenge is in the books and with the exceptional generosity of racers, Mesa Cycles, and the UFD, we are glad to be a part of the awesome St. Louis metro mountain bike community.

Here's to a great summer of riding, racing and celebrating the singletrack trails!

Official Race Results
http://unitedindirt.com/results/UFD-E2-Greensfelder_web.htm

Race Day Photos

GORC (Matt Hayes Gallery)
https://picasaweb.google.com/matthayes4/2011GreensfelderChallenge#

Jim Krewet / DRJ Photos
https://picasaweb.google.com/rhadrj/Greensfelder#

Off The Front Photography
http://otfphoto.com/p310626450

GORC Trailbuilding Statistics

 

 Area trails with their total mileage, and the part of each which was constructed by GORC 

GORC World HQ recently compiled the statistics showing the course of our trailbuilding efforts over the past 10 years, and they proved to be somewhat of an eye-opener, even to those who are actively involved in trail design and building.

Many people in the STL area probably take these trails for granted, or think that they were built with taxpayer money, and don't realize how much trail was really built by volunteer labor. Some of these trails listed have been around for a long time, others are brand new. One thing they have in common is that GORC has at some point contributed to them. The contributions range from very small, like construction of a short reroute on Berryman, and periodic maintenance there. Others are like SIUE, Klondike, or Creve Coeur where the trails were completely designed, built and actively maintained by GORC. We are not taking credit for all of the trails listed here, but the mileage totals speak for themselves. Many different outdoor-oriented groups make use of these trails, and we wanted to make it known how they came about.

GORC is really a pretty small group, and most of its effectiveness comes from being able to manage the logistical aspects of drawing together a shifting, and diverse pool of volunteer labor- not just mountain bikers, to get trails built. We need all the help we can get to continue to build and maintain trails in the area. Please consider attending a workday to help out. If you don't want to attend a workday, we'll also happily take your donations, but we'd rather have the labor.

 

Total trail mileage, and that constructed by GORC 

Area trail mileage constructed by year
The dip in production in 2005-06 was due to our hosting the Midwest Mountain Bike Festival, which took away a lot of time from design 

Field Test-- Fanno Bull Saw

I don't know what's nerdier, using a hand saw to cut out deadfall, or writing an article about it. Anyway, most people probably never give much thought to how those trees laying across the trail magically disappear. There are several ways: trail users remove smaller ones that can be moved by one or more people, or cut with a pack saw;  staff in many parks remove them once they are notified of the location;  or GORC sawyers, with the park's permission, cut them out. There are 5 or 6 active sawyers right now, so the same guys keep getting called on.

After spending a long evening recently dealing with Stinkbait's finicky Poulan to remove a couple of trees on Dogwood and DeClue, I decided chainsaws were a real pain. Not having any desire to own one, got me looking for alternatives, and I came across the Fanno Bull Saw, which is billed as a one-man crosscut saw.

I figured that if I could cut out these trees on Deer Run shown in the pictures, I could probably do anything because:
--the tree was green
--the crown was caught up in another tree putting it in compression
--the diameter was ~10-14"
-- the tree was high  off the ground and couldn't be supported it until it got lower
--it was hot
--my assistant had a short attention span

To make a short story short, it took about 45 minutes to make 4+ cuts. I think it would have been much faster had I used wedges, and all of the above stuff hadn't been against me. A chainsaw would have probably been done with everything in about 10 minutes or less, assuming everything went as expected. Overall, the time getting ready + time spent cutting probably balanced out.

Summary:
This saw works pretty smoothly, but was certainly more work than a chainsaw. The good things: much smaller investment; no time loading up bob-trailer and necessary equipment; no need for all the chainsaw safety equipment (chaps, earplugs); quiet, no smelly exhaust. I'll use it again for uncomplicated ones, but will probably leave the more difficult ones for a chainsaw.

Edit 3/30/11: Since I wrote the original post last fall, I've used the saw again at Greensfelder and SIUE. It really makes pretty quick work of trees up to about 10", and usually only takes a short time to get through, depending on how fit I am at the time... I've run into a few problems with trees that were lying flat on the ground, but as long as they're elevated enough to get the saw underneath as well, it hasn't been that big a deal.

Indian Camp Creek Workday- Saturday, March 26th 9am-1pm

When: Saturday, March 26th, from 9:00 til 1:00.

Where: Indian Camp Creek Park. It's approx 7 miles North of I-70 on 40/61. (Turn left on Dietrich Rd roughly .6 miles after passing W.) The Google Map link (click this for link, then click the Green bike) will take you to the Park. Follow the road around to the back of the Park, and look for signage that will direct you to Saturday's meeting location. (This'll have to do until Google updates their map from early 2006. )

What to bring: Gloves, Sturdy shoes, eye protection, and something to drink on the trail. Please read through pilznr’s “What to expect at a workday” post. It will also give you some hints on how to prepare for a workday.

Please RSVP via ONE of the following (to make sure we bring enough food):
The St. Charles County Park's (SCCP) office [636-949-7535],
through the WebTrac registration system on the parks website, or on this thread.

GORC & St. Charles County Parks will provide: Trail building tools, instructions on trail building, safety guidelines, and lunch.

NOTICE: In case of bad weather, please call the St. Charles County Parks (SCCP's) Trail Hotline (636-949-7475, option #2). SCCP's will only leave a message about the workday if it's canceled.

We've got ~ 40 Scouts and their parents coming out, so we could use some experienced workers. There's a reroute, plus a couple armoring projects on the list of things to do, so we've got something for everyone.

Lunch will be provided by Off The Front, so thank one of the team riders the next time you see them on the trails.

Don't forget this is another chance to enter the 2011 GORC Workday Season Raffle for a GT Peace 9r!

Ride Report: On the Middle Fork in the Middle of March

Lisa and I rode the Middle Fork Saturday in an effort to purge some early season non-riding weaknesses such as ... non-riding. Being that Ouachita is two weeks away or something it seemed wise to at least see if we could competently ride half of it by running the 'Middle Fork-xc loop' implemented by the Team Seagal troops.

Stats (mfxc loop version):
+31 miles total broken down as / 18.5 singletrack (part I) / 10 miles gravel (part II) / 2.5 miles singletrack (part III - you re-ride the first singletrack segment back to the trailhead)
+ 3,200 ft elevation more or less
+ guaranteed awesome trail or your money back
+ seems to be dry when you assume it would be wet like everything in metro STL
+ your feet will get wet at Barton Fen and thereafter

There is a longer full loop that takes you to the end of the Middle Fork section but I have yet to ride it. That loop would make the mileage top out at 38, the extra 7 evenly split between trail and gravel/road.

There's water running down the first major falls. Camping can be had just across the mini-gorge. It's an interesting geological oddity because the terrain near the creek drainage breaks away revealing the water cut rock and opens into an expansive, but relatively shallow valley.

Closeup of the falls in action. Later in the year it is just a trickle.

Burning sensation: The forestry service is currently burning 4,000 acres in the area and riding through this large patch on the Middle Fork is both alien and awesome at the same time. It's cool to easily see the singletrack flow ahead on the contours.

Another shot of the burned berms.

The Middle Fork section of the Ozark Trail is the newest segment to be built within the last eight years. Since its opening in 2005, the trail has grown close to the hearts of mountain bikers and hikers with terrific views, geological features, creeks and sustainable, lengthy climbs and descents. This trail allows contiguous access to North Trace/South Trace, Council Bluff and the Berryman Trail. You could destroy your bike and body before you rode everything offered at the corner of HWY 32 and DD.

Ride it and love it.

The Middle Fork section is to be renamed in honor of the Ozark Trail Association founder and volunteer, John Roth who passed away far too early, for his dedication to the Ozark Trail. Without his leadership and planning, the Middle Fork section would not have been possible. This section was completed in November of 2005 making the Ozark Trail the longest multi-use trail in Missouri. The Middle Fork section connects with the Trace Creek section just northeast of Highway 32 and runs south to the Karkaghne section at Highway J.

Wet-Weather Adventure I: When Ya Gotta Go, Ya Gotta Go: Taking a Dump on the Trail

In late February the thaw and wet weather cycle forced me to ride my road and cross bikes more than I desired but here I was, forced yet again to get some 'long-steady-miles' whether I wanted them or not.

Let's start by showing you what I wouldn't see on this trip...

That's the Greensfelder, for the record. Not anywhere close to the location of this episode.


With a goal of 50 miles on a early Thursday or Tuesday afternoon - I don't know - the wind carried me down into a Soulard preparing for Mardi Gras. Hookers at Johnny's set up tents and frat truckers quaffed Bud Light Lime.

Skipping 7th Street, I headed North on 3rd St. - the hell of the East. Broken and severely buckled pavement kept me alert while a headwind increased its volume. Shooting past the Arch, skimming by Hopeville, I settled into a nice rhythmn. I waved to the Hazmat crew that has been diligently working at the radioactive site between the trail and river bank for the past two weeks. I know it's radioactive because they have the radiation symbol... and the guys are in white suits. And big wigs seem to be watching from massive F-350s at all times. This is news that will never make it to air.

Anyway, I said I settled in, right? I did for about 15 minutes until I glimpsed a green minivan rounding just out of site. The flood wall curved to his benefit.

Normally, this is just what we call traffic on the Riverfront bike trail. Fish traffic, heavy machinery traffic, crack traffic, whores-for-crack traffic, rush hour overflow traffic, the trail sees it all.

I found out this was traffic fell under the dumping category.

On top of the levee just past the homes on barges, just far enough ahead the driver kept starting and stopping, obviously trying to set some distance between us. I looked down, grabbed some water and stopped to look at the supreme massive crane at the Alberici yard that must be building the piece parts for the oil refinery up the river.

Well, holy crap, I look up the trail after resuming a steady pace and I see the guy dumping his entire van out on either side of the trail.

Like a small apartment amount.

I rode up to the van and glanced over to him while he sat inside. Smoking a cigarette and looking directly at me, I'm pretty sure he questioned the 'hassle' it would be to throw me in the river.

I think it was going to be too much work.

I rode swiftly on, hoping that he didn't want to ask for directions to the nearest license center so he could get his plates renewed. When I turned around for a look, he has making a U on the levee and headed back to who knows where.

Story Shrink: ..., rode up to the Chain of Rocks, rode past 270 to Columbia Bottoms to check out the Confluence. Checked it out and headed back the way I came, past the Chain of Rocks, past the pimped out Mexican truck with every stick-on accessory AutoZone sold (stick on air scoops??) Rode past some abandoned cycling clothes and helmet by the creek drainage (la la la, I'm not thinking about what happened - they got hot ... and ran the other way.)

Came back upon the mini-landfill and attempted to find out 'who' this guy was so I could turn the info in.



I didn't know this was a new landfill. Otherwise, I would've pulled the BOB trailer with the ground plastic and leachate cleaning system. Now it's just going to drain into the river.





It's not in the picture but there's a box of canned food right over there. Corn, spinach, Chef Boyardee, Rice, Cupcakes (open), all with a light sheen of fry grease on the tops.


He has it on blu-ray now.


Because this is a public site with standards of sorts, I am self-censored from showing the pile of wicky-wicky tapes.


I did find several denied unemployment claim statements that had the same name on it. Riding on for about two miles I saw another vehicle approaching. ugh.

Miraculously, it was a CONSERVATION truck. The female agent took the letter and I told her all I knew. Of course, she asked for details. "Uh, green minivan, don't know the plates, black guy, smokin' a cigarette, didn't stop to ask." Case closed, unfortunately.




The story sounds like it should end bad. But that's just not true. Whenever you get on your bike, if you look around, you can best be assured there is an adventure somewhere looking to stir your interest... or drag you into the river.

Until next time, remember kids, recycle all you can and give the rest to the san man.

Matson Hill Workday- Saturday, March 12th

New trail construction at Matson Hill continues this Sat. March 12th from 9am-1pm. We'll be working on the next phase which is shown in green on the map.
Sign up and details are available here.

Forest City Trail

Route 66 Bicycles down in Rolla is finishing up the last loop of a trail which will give it a total mileage of 7.5 miles. The trail is located near St. James, MO, between St. Louis, and Rolla.
This is about 25 miles beyond the Bourbon exit heading to Berryman, so next time you're headed that way, or coming back from Syllamo and points west, you might want to stop and check it out. A map and description will be up on the trails page.

First Chance to Enter Raffle for GT Peace 9r

The workday at Greensfelder on Feb. 26th marks your first chance to enter the 2011 Workday Season Raffle for a GT Peace 9r donated by Ballwin Cycles. Yes, you can join the cool boys and girls and ride big wheels.

The rules are pretty straightforward:
-- Attend a minimum of 2 workdays.
-- Be a current GORC member in good standing.
-- The more workdays you attend, the more chances you have to win.
-- The drawing will be held at the end of the workday season.

Next chance will be March 12th at Matson Hill.

Greensfelder Workday- Saturday, Feb. 26th 9am-1pm

Finally, a new trail at Greensfelder that isn't rescuing an existing one!

Date: Sat, February 26th, 2010, 9am to 1pm (FREE LUNCH!) – Bike or Hike After!

Location: Greenfelder Park, St. Louis County

What: Our attention changes focus to developing new trail as we push North inside the park. We will be re-routing the Green Rock & Deer Run trails by combining them into a new, single trail. They will drop down from the Scenic road and ultimately connect with the Eagle Valley trail. This trail will be 1.5-2 miles of brand spanking new singletrack. Phase 1 of this project will be 0.5 mile hopefully completed before the Greensfelder Challenge MTB Race.

Where: Greensfelder Park, Allenton Rd. behind Six Flags (Park at Tower Lot)

Take Interstate 44 to the Allenton/Six Flags Exit 261. Go north on Allenton Rd, past the Six Flags entrance. Allenton Rd. bisects Greensfelder Park. Lunch will be afterwards at the Mueckerman Shelter located at the corner of Allenton and Hencken road.
(See www.gorctrails.com for directions and details of the park)

What to bring: Gloves, Sturdy shoes, eye protection, and something to drink on the trail.

GORC & St. Louis County Parks provide: Trail building tools, instructions on trail building, and safety guidelines.

Sign up and more info available here.

Coming Up... Jan/Feb

January 30th- Sunday, 9 a.m.-3 p.m. Midwest Bicycle Expo and Swap Meet. Once again GORC will be present at the Bike Swap Meet on January 30th, 2011. We will have (3) booths for GORC members to sell all those old bike parts you have laying around collecting dust.

February 2nd-  Wednesday, 7 p.m. The regular monthly meeting has been moved to the Granite City Brewery in Creve Coeur. If you're from out west, and have wanted to see what the meetings are all about, but didn't want to drive downtown, now is your chance.

February 26th- Saturday, 9 a.m.-1 p.m. Greensfelder workday. Trail expansion continues with new trail linking the DeClue/Green Rock and Eagle Valley. We're going to need a lot of help with this one.

Be Prepared

Tom shows how many nails it will take to sign the whole Berryman

(and probably every trail in Mark Twain Natl Forest)

Every year or so, GORC's chapter of the National Mountain Bike Patrol gets together for a refresher class on CPR/AED, and First Aid. This was the third year, and we talked about a few other things that were related to making sure everyone remains as safe as possible while they're out enjoying the trails.

Perry, the SLAG overlord, and first-aid expert brought up the so-called "10 Essentials" which are items that should be carried on every outdoor adventure. You might think that you're only out for a little mtb ride, what could happen?, but it's amazing how many people there are who are woefully unprepared when something really does go wrong. This was one of the main reasons the Patrol was started in the first place. With its motto "Assist, Educate, and Inform", the hope is to prepare patrollers in advance for an emergency, as well as help those who need it.

Perry also suggested looking at the REI website, which has a section called "Expert Advice" that has checklists, how-tos, and other advice on all sorts of activities, including one which is cycling-specific.

If you're interested in first-aid, or the Patrol, you can find out more information on IMBA's website, or by posting on the GORC message board.

Neither Snow nor Rain....

Next time you're out at SIUE enjoying the 3 newly rerouted sections of trail, please be sure to give thanks to the 25 brave and intrepid volunteers who were out taking care of the trails for you! All of the people who rode through the work sites certainly thanked us a lot.

Also, some exciting news about the trails in IL. Kirby will probably announce it whenever he decides that the privileged few who attended the workday have had enough time as the only ones to be in on the news.

2011 Winter/Spring Workday Schedule

1/15 - SIUE
2/26 - Greensfelder
3/12 - Matson Hill
3/26 - Indian Camp Creek
4/9 - Greensfelder
4/23 - Matson Hill
5/14 - Castlewood
5/21 - Cliff Cave
6/4 - Indian Camp Creek

December Meeting at TAP ROOM

Just a friendly reminder that next week's December 1st GORC monthly meeting will be held at the usual location - the Schlafly Taproom downtown at 7pm.

Come on out as it's our last meeting for 2010 and we hope to see everyone there.

Poll Question - Integration or Not? Read On...

Being a more complicated poll to explain, I've added a description here so you can be more informed.

The club has been approached to join forces with IMBA and integrate into their membership system. IMBA is pushing a Chapter program. Basically, all the membership would go through IMBA and we the club would receive 40% of the fees people pay to IMBA. All independent fund raising would still be 100% ours. Insurance costs would still be our responsibility. IMBA would take care of all the membership expenses with renewals, cards, that sort of thing. The GORC website would theoretically be a content managed site using IMBA's back-end civiCRM data-driven system. The website would look more like a portal website (joomla-based more than likely) and would also keep track of members.

In other words, regarding the poll below, would you be willing to join IMBA to support GORC or would you rather us (GORC) remain independent and we get 100% of the funds (your membership and donations). The big unknown is whether our members are BOTH IMBA and GORC members simultaneously.

Make sense? Now go cast your vote to let us know your thoughts. Feel free to comment on the forum or on this blog post.

Rock Hollow Workday-- Saturday, November 20th 9am-1pm

This Saturday, Nov 20th at 9am is the first workday in Rock Hollow. We will construct one of the difficult creek crossings on the east side of the hollow, to demonstrate our skills, and to provide a model for the PTBA bidders that will eventually build the trail.

Sue Bell, County Parks volunteer coordinator, projects there will be 80+ people there, so we need as many workday leaders as we can muster. We will meet at the Ridge Meadows School parking lot, on Ridge Rd, just south of Old State Rd.

Please everyone, show up, we need to make a good show. More information, including directions can be found here.

Cranksgiving 2010: A Pictorial

Lisa and I decided, at the last minute, to check out the 2010 Cranksgiving ride last weekend. I'd heard about the charity ride a couple of years ago but never got around to actually participating.

It's pretty cool to say the least. Cranksgiving is an organized ride approximately 24 miles in length, is a loop on commonly ridden roads - think Dogfish training ride, and stops by five supermarkets. Participants are asked to buy in total about $10-$20 worth of canned goods at one or more of the grocery stores. Riders are asked to carry the goods back to the start where they are displayed to show the enormity of hundreds of people donating the goods to Food Outreach. However, at a few stops the St. Louis Adventure Group (SLAG) worked sag so riders didn't have to lug heavy cans on their backs - you definitely want a messenger bag or backpack.

Apparently the St. Louis version is the fastest growing and had the largest turnout last year - 500 riders. This year's addition saw over 800 people and it was quite impressive seeing everyone riding single file (mostly) down Adams Road to Ballas.

We went in style as I borrowed the GORC full-squish BOB trailer and towed all the goods we purchased back to the start/finish. The cross bike felt a little squirrely near the end with about 30 pounds of canned goods following behind. And let me clarify the importance of the start/finish ..... at the Schlafly Bottleworks in Maplewood. The organizers, BicycleWorks, among others, know what riders want after a workout. Yup. Carbs.

Yes, it wasn't on dirt, and no, it didn't involve building trail, but it was for a good cause, got us on our bikes, and was very enjoyable... and great beer. I'd recommend it to other GORCers to attend the 2011 edition.

Here's some snaps we captured throughout the day.

Hybrid Turkey

Rolling start in Maplewood with police escort

Straub's in Webster Groves getting the treatment. Pick your canned goods wisely or you will pay, literally.

Determining the dynamic load bearing optimization flow ratio. I never solved the equation.

World's most useful kickstand

Approaching Cranksgiving headquarters - I smell hops. Notice the World Cup socks driving the bus that failed to achieve any semblance of speed and proved my lack of endurance and stamina is, in fact, quite real.

The wall of donations that arrived by bike. This is an early shot before the sag wagons arrived with about the same amount of goods.

Bottleworks bike parking. We saw the entire range of two-wheeled rides; cross bikes, clapped out beaters, tandems, NEXT/Pacific/enter-chinese-extreme-brand-here 11 inch travel freeride rigs, mountain bikes, hybrids, road bikes made of rusty steel, "" made of nice steel, titanium wonder rigs, carbon fibre - that's proper English - for the French-made Look featherweights, vintage Klein crust bikes featuring never-before-seen Brooks premium saddles, a bike with a fur saddle (extinct megafauna?), kids bikes, trikes for adults who never learned to ride and would prefer to slide under a Prius at a 4-way stop, hippies on 75cm road bikes with head tubes longer than your top tube, racers on race bikes, moms on race bikes, moms on hybrids, dads on powder blue Varsities, and on and on. You get the idea. All walks of life, all budgets, all liking the bike riding part. Better than the Moonlight Ramble (not as crowded), safer than the old Critical Mass disasters (less scary participants featuring kwik-kopy manifestos).

Drink on, you deserve it. Hot Liquor Porter, I'll have another. Next year - wide right turns tandem with BOB trailer?

Cliff Cave Map

Well, it was 5 years in the making, but it's finally here! The official GORC map for Cliff Cave County Park.

This can serve as another example of how someone who wants a trail somewhere decides that they're going to do what it takes to make it happen. There was no map, because there was no one with such an interest in Cliff Cave until recently. Enjoy the trails. The pdf version of the file will be here shortly.

GORC Water Bottles

Momentum Cycles now stocks water bottles with the ultra exclusive GORC logo emblazoned on them. Proceed at once to your local Momentum shop and pick up one, two or a dozen. Momentum has graciously offered to share $1 from the sale of each water bottle with GORC. So, you get to stay hydrated, Momentum get's your business and GORC get's your money to help build trail! Supplies are limited, so don't delay.